Neverside

Quote:

Originally posted by Speed
Pledge allegiance to the flag...you're not american are you?

I am

Quote:

Originally posted by nykoelle
I don't think its pushing religion on you. It doesnt say waht god, simply, a higher power. Any form of higher governing power. I think it should stay. It shows this nation as pious. It would be like changing the money and stuff around too. No, I definitely don't think we should go down that road.

right

Quote:

Originally posted by jadedchron
keep it. who cares. it's not like it's one nation under satan :\

Satan...

Satan is in controll of the non-saved world.

But, it has God capitalized, which infers the overseeing power of the Christian religion.

The word God (notice the capital g) is a title specifically given to the overseeing power of the Christian religion.
The word god (notice the lowercase g) is a word which is used to envelop the overseeing powers of many religions (Buddhism, Christianity, Muslim, Hindu). Respective gods are (Buddha, God, Allah, I don't know).

It's really all in the wording and puncuation. As it is, it should not be included. If they decide to change it to god, then that would be fine.

hmm... I never thought of that, though still, I'm not sure we have place to change it. You do have a good point.

one thing I think of, is that our founding fathers were Christian. That is the more probable reason we have God on our money and in our pledge. I still don't see why it should come out of of those things though. Its "One Nation Under God"

meaning, we're one united nation, that some believe to be under god, not necessarily me.

Thaats my interpretation. Thats another thing, its subject to interpretation.

I'm not hristian myself, maybe athiest? I believe in a higher power, but not religion. I don't know how thats categorized. I myself don't take offence to that.

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:: pop ::

the USA has evolved from what the founding fathers once were, and thats good. things need to continue to evolve along with society. so now that it is recognized that people have religions that have NO god it should be respected. Buddhism is based on a teacher not a god, should we not respect that. Athiests don't believe in any god, should that not be respected either? As this was an additive to the Pledge in the fifties...if it can be added, why can't it be removed?

No I don't think it should be a huge issue because it isn't an issue at all. It shouldn't be there, its the same thing with the ten commandments...

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I think square is top of cool shape in the world.

Quote:

Originally posted by nykoelle

I'm not hristian myself, maybe athiest? I believe in a higher power, but not religion. I don't know how thats categorized. I myself don't take offence to that.

I think that's agnostic or something like that. You beleive in a higher being but have no religion.

Quote:

The word God (notice the capital g) is a title specifically given to the overseeing power of the Christian religion.
The word god (notice the lowercase g) is a word which is used to envelop the overseeing powers of many religions (Buddhism, Christianity, Muslim, Hindu). Respective gods are (Buddha, God, Allah, I don't know).
It's really all in the wording and puncuation. As it is, it should not be included. If they decide to change it to god, then that would be fine.

But what about those who have no god?

I've thought of not standing for the pledge in hope that I will make this issue heard, and scribbling every "In God we trust" off of every peice of paper currency I get.
Cause it's not just the pledge that I think is against the freedom of religion, it's anything with the word God printed on it.

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Vector Porn OMGWTFBBQ!!!1

Speed, research Pascal's Wager.

If you do not believe that God exists - but rather the belief in nothing (atheism) - than why does it matter if there is that statement "One nation under God"? You do not believe, so it makes no difference to you whether God is really watching over you or not.

Secondly, Nicole is not an agnostic. If she was she would be saying "I'm not sure whether God exists or not, there is just not enough information."

Saying that she does not have a religion but believes in a higher power is actually right. The basis and meanig of religion is the tie (ligio) between God and man, and man and man. The relationship between God and man is not there - which in some ways makes her a deist.

I'm with amp. By saying the pledge, its not saying "I believe in god" You make up your own beliefs. This country was founded by Christians as a Christian country. Your basically reciting history when you recite the pledge. No one is saying you have to believe. So, do just that, believe what you wish, but don'y deny a country's history and foundation.

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:: pop ::

Hopping mad...

I get hopping mad when I read debate threads like this so please forgive me if I lose my cool...

I think "one nation under God" should be kept in our Pledge. Reason number one, I believe in God and I'm a born again Christian. Reason number two, the founders of this country believed in God; and if you have "under God" removed from our pledge, your slapping our founding fathers right in the face with your selfish behaviour. Whether you believe in God or not, our founding fathers did; they founded the country, they founded our pledge.

It's as simple as this: you watch a movie, even something like a Disney animated... the movie may have a Catholic church in it... are you going to have Disney remove the scene with the Catholic church in it just because your not a Catholic? Same applies to our pledge bud.

You are misinformed. The founding fathers did not "found" the pledge. They had absolutely nothing to do with it. It was not formed until 1892, barely 100 years ago.
http://history.vineyard.net/pledge.htm
http://www.usflag.org/pledgeofallegiance.html

And why are we reciting something formed by a socialist anyway? Aren't we a democratic society?

Your analogy doesn't work. You're applying fantasy to real life. Everyone knows that 95% of movies are fantasy. Why do you think they use Catholicism in movies? Because it's the most well known and controversial form of Christianity.
Having "One nation under God" in our pledge is REAL, not fantasy and make beleive. It was a mistake by the government to adapt something that is not accepted by everybody and written by a socialist (who by the way in the 40s to the early early 70s were arrested for their beliefs).

/ Playing devils advocate